Pfc. Jessica Lynch is awarded the Bronze Star


3. Criteria:
a. The Bronze Star Medal is awarded to any person who, while serving in any capacity in or with the military of the United States after 6 December 1941, distinguished himself or herself by heroic or meritorious achievement or service, not involving participation in aerial flight, while engaged in an action against an enemy of the United States; while engaged in military operations involving conflict with an opposing foreign force; or while serving with friendly foreign forces engaged in an armed conflict against an opposing armed force in which the United States is not a belligerent party.

b. Awards may be made for acts of heroism, performed under circumstances described above, which are of lesser degree than required for the award of the Silver Star.

c. Awards may be made to recognize single acts of merit or meritorious service. The required achievement or service while of lesser degree than that required for the award of the Legion of Merit must nevertheless have been meritorious and accomplished with distinction.

I am pretty sure they are going with 3.c here. “Awards may be made to recognize single acts of merit or meritorious service. “

My questions are do you think she deserves the Bronze Star, and what single act of merit or meritorious service was there? I have not read or heard about any. I am curious if some of the folks here have.
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07-22-03, 02:12 PM
Lydia
While I think it's incredible that she made it through the ordeal that she did, I have to agree with you. I have not heard of any act of merit that she performed. Again - I think it's incredible that she was able to survive, but other than that, there was nothing of particular note. Perhaps there are things that we do not know?

07-22-03, 03:35 PM
Kwll
Koz, funny but I asked the same question today. I guess I would have to read the citation but I know an awful lot of guys from any war who were awarded a campaign ribbon and told to have a nice day for far more than what this looks like. At least no "V" device was included.

07-22-03, 04:37 PM
NCcichlid
Not only was she awarded the bronze star but the POW ribbon and the Purple Heart. The bronze star concerns me, but the military escort home really raises my hackles.

For the full story that follows, click on Stars and Stripes, June 2000
"This time last year, an Air Force lieutenant colonel was leading a team of mechanics and maintenance crews at Whiteman Air Force Base, Mo., making sure the B-2 bomber was a regular player in the air campaign against Yugoslavia some 5,000 miles away. For his efforts, he is among the nearly 200 Air Force members to receive the nation’s fourth-highest combat award, the Bronze Star.

And like the lieutenant colonel, the vast majority of those who received the coveted awards did so for actions far from the combat zone...

So far, in fact, that it has radically changed the way troops are being recognized for their wartime contributions. For the first time in U.S. history, scores of troops who never went near the combat zone are being given Bronze Star combat medals, while — perhaps ironically — most of the ground troops closest to the fighting have gotten none."

07-22-03, 04:54 PM
Kwll
Yep NC, kinda ticked me off when I read that one too. However, I must also point out that a lot of guys during Desert Storm got them for relatively light contributions based on position or responsibility levels vs actions. As long as they keep the V device consistent it really doesn't matter in the long run. But I agree that in this case we don't know what was actually done by Welch other than she may or may not have emptied her magazine, whether anything was hit is a different matter altogether. She was qualified to receive the Purple Heart and POW Ribbon however, but perhaps nothing more. This is certainly looking like it is based on celebrity alone and the fact that she is a photogenic poster child.

07-22-03, 09:13 PM
honilov
This is the kind of thing that I've been trying to get my point across to, for a long time. Roll Eyes

07-23-03, 02:30 AM
SeattleRon
is it just the media and the government that are trying to hype this whole thing and turn it into propaganda?
I don't know a whole lot about how these things work really, but howcome the other people that got shot or injured in the war aren't getting the same attention?

07-23-03, 05:57 AM
Kati99
Ron, I agree with you. I also think they're using this story for propaganda.

07-23-03, 06:58 AM
Adi
What is the qualification for a Purple Heart? And why is she qualified for the POW Ribbon? POW = Prisoner of War, doesn't it? I thought that means you have to be at war... which means Congress.... oh never mind.

Seems like medals in the US Army get handed out like confetti at a wedding.

If it looks like it, smells like it, then it probably is....

07-23-03, 08:11 AM
Koz
I agree with Kwll that she was qualified to receive the Purple Heart and POW Ribbon, and that I am glad that at least no "V" device was included too.
Purple Heart criteria
POW Medal & Ribbon criteria

Criteria: a. The Prisoner of War Medal is issued only to those U.S. military personnel who were taken prisoner and held captive after 5 April 1917;
(1) While engaged in an action against an enemy of the United States;
(2) While engaged in military operations involving conflict with an opposing foreign force; or

When I picked up my newspapers this morning I noticed something else. Pfc. Jessica Lynch seems to be wearing a Presidential Unit Citation.

I know several people who have received the Presidential Unit Citation. Again I see nothing in this story that makes me believe this Citation was fairly awarded here.

I too know many people who have fought valiantly in wars and operations that were awarded simply a campaign ribbon and told to be on their way.

07-23-03, 08:44 AM
Kwll
Koz, Army unit citations work a little different than other services. She may have been wearing one that was awarded to her unit for years past which is temporary and she may only wear it while in that unit. Permanent awarding of that ribbon comes if the member was a part of the unit when it was awarded.

honilov, its easy to think that there are some high level machinations of what is going on at some upper level and is all tied together as propaganda but actually doesn't quite work that way. All the people involved including some higher levels do get involved in the moment and sometimes momentum overtakes them as well such as this story with Lynch. I think it likely that some people in the Army felt like she may have just made the cut line for this award and felt it would be good for the Army's image and not some Machiavellian plan tied into the current Administration. Also we don't know all the facts, what she actually did may still be classified as I now I haven't read anything of what she has done yet and it hasn't been published in the Army Times which is unusual. Guess I will have to wait until next week's issue.

Adi, as far handing outr medals like candy that is simply not true. For 99% of the soldiers out there medals are fairly hard won. Certainly there are lesser ribbons that most people get such as for service and military education level, good conduct etc. But the "real" awards such as Commendation medals and above are fairly rare and difficult to get.

07-23-03, 08:54 AM
Adi
KwII

But it seems like it's pretty easy to get a Purple Heart. Just get a nick when your country is at war and you're entitled to it.... or am I wrong?

07-23-03, 09:52 AM
Kwll
Adi, not quite that easy...first off I don't know anybody who really "wants" a purple heart, that is one we all tend to want to avoid. But it is based on the recommendation of a doctor who treats the wounds and then approved or disapproved by the commander, so not everyone who gets injured in combat gets a Purple Heart. Most are based on some action inflicted by the enemy, for example accidents in a combat zone during combat do not count.

07-23-03, 11:16 AM
Elexina
She deserves the bronze star because she's a woman, duh! And because she broke her legs in a car accident and was freed in a "daring" rescue! Duh!
Seriously, she did her job and unfortunately ended up being captured for it. She deserves the medal for being injured in battle, but I don’t think she did anything any more heroic than her other comrades in arms. She did her job, that’s all.

07-23-03, 08:44 PM
honilov
So true, Elexina.

Kwll, you said the key words...'it would be good for the Army's image'.

07-26-03, 11:30 AM
Scotty
If she is to receive the Bronze Star for her actions ,then everyone who has ever been in combat should receive one.I see no reason why she should get the Bronze Star.

07-26-03, 12:07 PM
Kwll
Roger that Scotty.

07-26-03, 08:12 PM
windblowing
Ron is right, It is hype to take the spotlight off the President.

07-28-03, 08:16 AM
Kwll
windblowing, I guess you didn't read my post. It doesn't work that way.

07-28-03, 02:09 PM
DorianGreyed
She was awarded the Bronze Star for only political reasons, propaganda, if you will. This is no more a slam on Bush than many other presidents who have done the same thing, regardless of party affiliation. This action will, in some minds, serve to lessen the negative press about the reality of her rescue. (The British press has covered this far more honestly than ours.) All wars need heroes to rally the people back home. This war in particular needs that, as support is eroding daily. Thus, a young female, pretty, who now has a "promise" ring from her home-town boyfriend ends up a "Hero." Let's face it, this plot sounds like a bad LifeTime movie Made for Television. The saddest part is that many who deserve special recognition are ignored or passed over, and that her "Honor" cheapens the award. In a world where average pro athletes are called Stars, and good ones are now SuperStars, the entire value system of just who should be honored is skewed. Whether one supports this, or any, war has no bearing on the acts of bravery and self sacrifice performed. While this may be the most recent (and certainly one of the most blatant) attempts at obscuring the truth about what was done during a war, it isn't the first, and, unfortunately, it won't be the last. And, frankly, as long as we buy it, accepting it docilely, it is what we may deserve.

07-28-03, 04:30 PM
aminator2002
Pfc. Jessica Lynch is awarded the Bronze Star
I am glad she's alright, but she doesn't deserve anything more than a Purple Heart.

The media has really made her into a poster girl.

Equality.... this won't help.

10-04-03, 05:41 PM
cyberlaol
Don't forget the book deal I heard she is doing! I am sure it will make all the frustrations of her life a lot sweeter.

11-04-03, 09:39 PM
honilov
In addition to her book deal, hero Roll Eyes Lynch is getting married.

11-05-03, 02:52 PM
Kwll
Lets not put all this negativism on her, she was in the wrong place at the wrong time and didn't ask for all this attention that has been heaped upon her. She served her nation honorably and has done nothing wrong that I can see.

11-05-03, 04:59 PM
methos
I'm not sure what the comment about marriage was supposed to mean. Is she supposed to be single all her life because she was captured and injured in a war, and then had more praise than was deserved (and more than she asked for) heaped on her?

11-05-03, 07:52 PM
honilov
Actually Methos, I wouldn't give a hoot if she married this very minute. I only said it because all this is in the news together, and when you mention one, the others pop in your mind too. Is that alright?

Any which way you turn it, she's no hero, but her rescuers are. Roll Eyes

11-06-03, 07:12 AM
Fourbrick
From The Guardian in May 2003

"The doctors told us that the day before the special forces swooped on the hospital the Iraqi military had fled. Hassam Hamoud, a waiter at a local restaurant, said he saw the American advance party land in the town. He said the team's Arabic interpreter asked him where the hospital was. "He asked: 'Are there any Fedayeen over there?' and I said, 'No'." All the same, the next day "America's finest warriors" descended on the building.

"We heard the noise of helicopters," says Dr Anmar Uday. He says that they must have known there would be no resistance. "We were surprised. Why do this? There was no military, there were no soldiers in the hospital.

"It was like a Hollywood film. They cried, 'Go, go, go', with guns and blanks and the sound of explosions. They made a show - an action movie like Sylvester Stallone or Jackie Chan, with jumping and shouting, breaking down doors." All the time with the camera rolling. The Americans took no chances, restraining doctors and a patient who was handcuffed to a bed frame.

There was one more twist. Two days before the snatch squad arrived, Al-Houssona had arranged to deliver Jessica to the Americans in an ambulance. "I told her I will try and help you escape to the American Army but I will do this very secretly because I could lose my life." He put her in an ambulance and instructed the driver to go to the American checkpoint. When he was approaching it, the Americans opened fire. They fled just in time back to the hospital. The Americans had almost killed their prize catch.

A military cameraman had shot footage of the rescue. It was a race against time for the video to be edited. The video presentation was ready a few hours after the first brief announcement. When it was shown, General Vincent Brooks, the US spokesman in Doha, declared: "Some brave souls put their lives on the line to make this happen, loyal to a creed that they know that they'll never leave a fallen comrade."

None of the details that the doctors provided Correspondent with made it to the video or to any subsequent explanations or clarifications by US authorities. I asked the Pentagon spokesman in Washington, Bryan Whitman, to release the full tape of the rescue, rather than its edited version, to clear up any discrepancies. He declined. Whitman would not talk about what kind of Iraqi resistance the American forces faced. Nor would he comment on the injuries Lynch actually sustained. "I understand there is some conflicting information out there and in due time the full story will be told, I'm sure," he told me."

Heroes?

11-12-03, 08:19 PM
Sailracer
Let's cut this soldier some slack,guys. She did not invite the attention she's received, has not promoted any of it, and in fact has tried to dispute what the government says happened. Blame the press, the administration if you want, but this soldier was in harms way, got captured and wounded, and as far as I can tell, served her country honorably. As far as the book deal, why not? She didn't ask for the publicity, might as well jump on the bandwagon of those who started it, except this soldier won't be doing too much jumping for a while. Give her some credit for serving her country; SHE never called herself a "hero"!

11-12-03, 09:23 PM
DorianGreyed
SR, I really didn't see any real bashing, although I really think she should turn the Medal back in, especially in light of what she revealed in interviews aired in the last few days. Most of the flak has been directed at the military or, more accurately, those above the military. And you are right, she never did call herself a hero. I am glad that she has come forward with the truth, and I hope she continues. The publicity and book deal aside, it is now very obvious that she did nothing to earn a Bronze Star, and she knows it better than anyone. I just wish she would take that next step.

11-13-03, 11:07 AM
Kendor

quote:Originally posted by honilov:
Any which way you turn it, she's no hero, but her rescuers are. Roll Eyes

I believe that anyone that has been in a live combat situation without turning tail and running, is a hero.

11-13-03, 10:22 PM
honilov
Kendor, if that's true, then why weren't the other hostages in her company labeled heros? She said she was scared, covered her head/face and didn't shoot. The other lady hostage in her company went down shooting with all she had, and was severely injured. Can you explain that?

There are even lies in her book but at least she had the decency to tell the truth. She is a hero for telling the truth, but that's all.

By the way, I'm not the only one in this thread that thinks she's no hero. Could it be that I'm the only one that ruffles your feathers, and if so, why? Peace

11-14-03, 01:00 AM
auntikhaki
Jessica Lynch agrees that she is no hero and that lies were told about her while she was unconscious and recovering from her injuries. Nov. 6, Dianne Sawyer Interview
I'm not disturbed that a person is receiving a medal when she may not deserve it. Lots of soldiers are never recognized for their valor and that's unfair as Lynch has stated.

I'm concerned that a severely injured and unconscious soldier was not protected by the military from the media vultures and others that spread lies about her. I really respect her parents for holding off these scavengers as long as they did, and I respect Lynch for her honesty and her service.

11-14-03, 06:37 AM
DorianGreyed
Auntikhaki, I think "the others" that were spreading the lies were the military and the government; at least, they told the lies that I saw. I have to assume that the Army does not award such a medal based on press accounts, especially when the government/military controlled what the press saw at that time.

11-14-03, 07:08 AM
Kendor
No honi, you don't ruffle my feathers. It's just my opinion when I say that all of them are heros. It takes something special to even have put ones' self in that situation. (None of these soldiers were drafted). It's amazing that the most powerful military in the world is 100% voluntary.

11-14-03, 10:49 AM
frankvan
QUOTE: "She didn't ask for the publicity, might as well jump on the bandwagon of those who started it".

She seems to continue getting more publicity than she asked for. Pornographer Larry Flynt claims to have nude pictures of her in a military setting. Stay tuned. Roll Eyes

11-14-03, 05:18 PM
Thaddeus831
Honi,

Here is the answer to your last question (Why weren't any of the other hostages labeled heroes?).
Click Here

If the URL doesn't work, do a search for Pfc. Patrick Miller, Silver Star recipient.

11-14-03, 09:47 PM
honilov
Thanks for the link, Thaddeus. It is very interesting, and Patrick Miller is a true hero.

This message has been edited. Last edited by: DorianGreyed,