"I've seen this question put to you a few times now, but have yet to see you satisfactorily answer it, so I'll try again. You claim to be agnostic on the issue of God, but are you also agnostic about the veritable infinitude of other entities and events that cannot strictly be disproven (alien abductions, boogeymen, phenomenological gremlins)? Do you regard their existence as being equally probable as their nonexistence? You should at least be consistent in that ignorance you wield like a KJV Bible."
"Do you regard their existence as being equally probable as their nonexistence?"
How would you, as a agnostic, answer this question?
I don't think you can answer yes.
You can answer no, but then the burden is on you to prove god is more probable than pink elephants. ************************************************************ 03-14-06, 11:18 PM jusork I see no reason to think any agnostic should be any more or less sure about alien abductions than God. Both are very slim and at a lack of true evidence, but my mind doesn't know everything. Boogeymen, phenomenological gremlins, on the other hand, have a little more doubt since we can likely prove they don't exist because there has been no known experience of them.
Here's a question for you. Do you believe that alien abductions are as real as you believe God is? If not, how can you easily have faith in God but not in alien abduction?
03-15-06, 02:33 AM Bo Cuse me, this is a question from an atheist.
I am an agnostic.
It is embarrassing when my agnostic “faith” is challenged by strong atheists with this question and being called a weak atheist.
Edited to remove link.
This message has been edited. Last edited by: Karrow, 03-15-06 06:25 PM
03-15-06, 06:55 AM Elexina I don't see the point in arguing with people -religious or non- who are so wrapped up in themselves that they can't see beyond their own viewpoints. If you are comfortable with your beliefs (or non-beliefs), then it shouldn't matter to you what others think or choose to label you. You can just be content in knowing that you understand yourself and they do not.
As to the question itself: if you are agnostic as to the existence of deity, why would you automatically believe or disbelieve other things for which there is an equal lack of evidence. I'm not exactly sure what a "phenomenological gremlin" is, but their existence is a lot more likely than that of God, in my book! So I would answer: Yes. I believe that the existence of such creatures and phenomenon is equally probable as their nonexistence (though their nonexistence -and God's- seems far more likely to me).
03-15-06, 11:59 AM jusork
quote: Originally posted by Bo: Cuse me, this is a question from an atheist.
Oh, woops. For some reason, I looked over who was posing the argument. I must be in Christian-opposing mode. Roll Eyes
03-15-06, 12:15 PM Sarai
quote: Originally posted by Bo: "I've seen this question put to you a few times now, but have yet to see you satisfactorily answer it, so I'll try again. You claim to be agnostic on the issue of God, but are you also agnostic about the veritable infinitude of other entities and events that cannot strictly be disproven (alien abductions, boogeymen, phenomenological gremlins)? Do you regard their existence as being equally probable as their nonexistence? You should at least be consistent in that ignorance you wield like a KJV Bible."
I disagree. First, I would say I am totally agnostic when it comes to aliens - I really have no idea. I'm also agnostic about a large number of strange things - ESP, mediums, ghosts, etc. I really don't know. I am particularly open to the ideas of things that people I know and love claim to have experienced. For example, my husband sometimes has dreams that come true. That could very well be a coincidence, so I wouldn't say I'm a believer, but I won't rule out the possibility that one can dream about the future, either.
I know people who claim to feel a certainty about God inside, or even people claim to have witnessed spiritual phenomena that indicates that there is more to this life than the material world around us. Again, there are rational reasons to dispute them, but I really don't know. It could go either way.
I am NOT equally agnostic about pink elephants. I don't know anyone who believes they have seen one, and I don't know anyone who believes in them. It makes sense to trust that there might be some truth to what others say. If no one else I've ever met ever talks about having an experience with pink elephants (or unicorns, or magic beans), then why would I entertain such ideas?
I have no doubt that someone will come back with some person who claims to believe in Pink elephants and unicorns. All I can say is that I put stock into what people I know, love and respect claim to have seen and experienced. I do not put stock into what everyone claims to have seen and experienced, however.
I entertain the idea of religion because there are people who I know and love who believe in it. I know they might be wrong, but I'm not inclined to dismiss people who I know are intelligent and rational in the same way that I would dismiss a child who believes in unicorns.
I think agnosticism in the face of the fact that there are so many witnesses and yet no evidence is perfectly reasonable. Atheism is reasonable because what the witnesses say doesn't always make sense and sometimes seems totally irrational. Religion can be reasonable because what the witnesses say seems to strike a chord inside of us, what they say can feel inspiring and meaningful. But there is certainly no reason to say that agnostics are less reasonable than atheists (or religious people).
03-18-06, 09:28 AM revpo AGNOSTICS hold their own belief, belief in reference to aliens..I couldnt believe, have no interest in an alien and have never seen one, has anybody?
revpo
03-18-06, 12:04 PM clarebear As for the belief in God:
”For those who believe, no proof is necessary. For those who don't believe, no proof is possible.”
~Stuart Chase~
03-18-06, 12:34 PM sheanima
quote: Originally posted by Bo: "I've seen this question put to you a few times now, but have yet to see you satisfactorily answer it, so I'll try again. You claim to be agnostic on the issue of God, but are you also agnostic about the veritable infinitude of other entities and events that cannot strictly be disproven (alien abductions, boogeymen, phenomenological gremlins)? Do you regard their existence as being equally probable as their nonexistence? You should at least be consistent in that ignorance you wield like a KJV Bible."
"Do you regard their existence as being equally probable as their nonexistence?"
How would you, as a agnostic, answer this question?
I don't think you can answer yes.
You can answer no, but then the burden is on you to prove god is more probable than pink elephants.
Bo, I know you directed this question to Agnostics, but I'd like to submit my viewpoint. I don't practice a religion, but I do believe in a higher power, which is I consider the source of all life. It's called by different names, a few being Source, Infinite Intelligence, Infinite Spirit, God, etc.
alien abductions
That isn't my thing, but I guess it could be possible. If it has really happened, I think that those people experiencing such things could somehow be attracting something which exists in another dimension. This is just a theory, though. Who knows. It's just one of those things that can't be explained, yet. At any rate, I don't identify with those sort of happenings. But if I met someone who appeared stable and credible, and they claimed they had experienced an encounter of sorts, I wouldn't rule them out as looney. After all, when you stop and think about it, it doesn't sound logical to think that we are the only planet with living creatures, in all of ever-expanding existence.
If you're old enough, you'll recall that it was the anti-religious who scoffed at those who asserted that this planet is the only one that inhabits life as we know it. Then, over the decades, after being influenced by modern science and consideration of various possibilities, and momentarily setting aside the ego, many of those religious ones began to have a more open mind about it. Now that you have this situation, it's the anti-religious who have turned around and are currently attempting to discount this scientific possibility, by using it as a tool to discredit those who believe in God. Funny how things turn full circle, then inside out.
bogeymen (from Dictionary.com)
1) A terrifying specter; a hobgoblin. 2) An imaginary monster used to frighten children
With regard to the first definition, I tend to not to entertain myself with those things. To each his own.
As for the second one, it is exactly what it says: imaginary. If you'll notice, the dictionary didn't say that the first definition was imaginary. (I don't do imaginary monsters, either.)
gremlins
Falls under the category of bogeymen.
You can answer no, but then the burden is on you to prove god is more probable than pink elephants.
It depends on what your definition of God is. Regardless as to whether this can be done yet, is of little to no importance, although it would be fascinating to do. Thus, there is no burden of proof to bear. You have the freedom of 3 choices: Believe it, doubt it, or reject it, which makes for interesting discussions such as this one. Wink
NOTE: Most people, since the beginning of human history, have believed in the existence of a god or gods. There has been not one instance in history where someone has believed in a pink elephant. So this analogy is not an accurate one.
This message has been edited. Last edited by: sheanima, 03-19-06 12:46 PM
03-18-06, 01:24 PM clarebear
quote: Originally posted by sheanima: ... There has been not one instance in history where someone has believed in a pink elephant. So this analogy is not an accurate one.[/color]
The Ganeshoo Gesundheit is the God of all holy spirits. Many worship the pink elephant.
quote: Originally posted by sheanima: ... There has been not one instance in history where someone has believed in a pink elephant. So this analogy is not an accurate one.[/color]
The Ganeshoo Gesundheit is the God of all holy spirits. Many worship the pink elephant.
Ha! Yeah, right.
03-18-06, 01:36 PM clarebear Big Grin
03-18-06, 02:04 PM sheanima
quote: Originally posted by clarebear: Big Grin
That's a cute one, clarebear. I have to save it to my documents. Wink
03-20-06, 08:36 AM Elexina
quote: Originally posted by revpo: ...I couldnt believe, have no interest in an alien and have never seen one, has anybody?
I dunno, I've met some rather strange birds, and had some rather strange boyfriends... Wink
This message has been edited. Last edited by: DorianGreyed,
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