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Diamond
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Picture of Mozart
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My wife,who speaks some English( she speaks French) was watching the National news on TV , and came to ask me "why do they say mosquitoe bites"? They sting!

What is the term used in Spanish? Why do they say bites, if they have no teeth?
 
Posts: 6444 | Location: u.s.a, south Florida | Registered: 06-03-02Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Diamond
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The most common word in Spanish is "picar" 'to sting, bite'
 
Posts: 7717 | Location: On Vacation | Registered: 06-06-02Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Diamond
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It says here that mosquitos actually 'stab':

'When the mosquito stabs her needle-like mouthparts through the skin of her victim, she injects her saliva -- teeming with digestive enzymes and anticoagulants. The first time a person is bitten, there is no reaction. With subsequent bites, the person becomes sensitized to the foreign proteins, and small, itchy, red bumps appear about 24 hours later.'
 
Posts: 8186 | Location: Canada | Registered: 06-03-02Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Diamond
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Mozart: the French and Francophones are so precise aren't they? Smile

Perhaps not, or no more than we are. Suppose the word for 'to sting' (French 'piquer') referring to an insect, referred to the itch, the reaction, rather than the wound itself so 'to sting' was to cause that reaction then what we say is logical.

In truth, English speakers say bitten or stung for the mosquito; that demonstrates a typical refinement in English which, some might say, is lacking in French (not me: I have to live there Eek )

Here's a nicety. Please ask Madame Mozart what words are used in French for a snake biting Wink I'm prepared to hazard a guess that , whilst she will say 'mordre' ( to bite) she will admit to 'piquer' (to sting) being used too. So an animal with no stinger can sting (French) but an insect with no teeth can bite (English) Smile Of course, the French may say that piquer is the word for pricking with a pin or injecting with a needle so they are concentrating on the means of penetrating and or the wound being a single punctate one.That could be reverse reasoning. Piquer for 'to sting' of an insect, could have come first, before its use for to make a needle wound,a prick with a pin, to inject, that is, it referred originally to the sensation, the itch or pain, not the wound, the injury .Thinking about it the Frenchman saying 'piquer' as in a mosquito bite, for a snake biting is thinking the same. There is a stinging sensation or other such sensation, a reaction to the venom that we feel, when we get bitten by a snake.

We get 'stung' by a wasp or bee (so do the French who are , you could say 'piqued' by it; piquer is where 'piqued' came from , after all ) but not 'bitten' by one.This may show us as logical on another ground too. We realised that these insects have a mechanism, a sting(er) (in French 'dard' or 'aiguillon',literally also 'spear' or 'needle') evolved specifically for that purpose whereas a mosquito does not. On the other hand the female mosquito has a mechanism for piercing skin and drawing blood; that is not a stinger, evolved for the purpose of defence or for hunting ; but akin to a biting mechanism.

The horse-fly has mouth parts which are like a V-blade on a chisel and gouges a groove when it penetrates your skin. The wound from that must qualify as a bite; look at the damage, never mind the mechanism employed and its lack of dentine Big Grin. No wonder it hurts so much by comparison to the mosquito's when the wound is made. You really feel it whereas watch a mosquito bite you and feel nothing until the chemical reaction starts. It doesn't really sting though, because it brings no irritant chemical or reaction with it to cause that sudden itch.What's more, English people say that a horse or human has been bitten by a horsefly rather than 'stung' by one (or at least the horsey folk here around Newmarket, the centre for horseracing do). So we draw the distinction between cause and consequences.

OK ? (As the French say). Hope this subject does not cause 'le stress' (ditto) between you and Madame !
 
Posts: 9076 | Location: Newmarket, UK/ Antibes, S.France | Registered: 07-14-02Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Diamond
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No stress made Fred, but the term is impossible in French [mordu par un moustique], unless found in "slang " somewhere.Which brings me to the issue,that it started on American National TV, which should be as close as possible to "correctness.

Is the term correct according to, let say Oxford, which would compare to "Academie de la langue Française",who determine what is wrong or right?

No mouth........no bites!! SmileComment mordre sans bouche?

Ps: Allowed would be a newborn baby wihout teeth trying to "bite your finger" still it needs a mouth.

Even a "serpent ne pique pas mais il mord"

I guess the distinction between the languages,here,is made [in French] by the visuality of the action and not the "cause and consequences" as you mentioned. Smile
 
Posts: 6444 | Location: u.s.a, south Florida | Registered: 06-03-02Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Diamond
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I'd never claim 'mordu par un moustique' Mozart and I can't think it's in slang either. However Collins -Robert gives piquer as an alternative to mordre in the case of the snake and at one time so did we say in English, the serpent's sting. We have no equivalent of L'Academie in England. The Oxford English Dictionary is updated by reference only to what words are in use and in what way they are used. It does not lay down what is correct. It is a book of record not of law. That's a good feature of English. We don't have word police. Nobody is telling us not to use French words or phrases in advertisements but, if we must, to give a translation underneath, as is the case with English in France
 
Posts: 9076 | Location: Newmarket, UK/ Antibes, S.France | Registered: 07-14-02Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
Diamond
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And now I've checked with the big two volume Robert Dictionnaire, just in case the bilingual Robert et Collins one had misled.That's as close to the Shorter Oxford English Dictionary as we get in French It too gives piquer (to prick with a needle/ to sting etc ) for a snake, a serpent, saying helpfully that it is used 'for piercing by a fang with venom (compare mordre)'. So that 'bite' stings too Smile
 
Posts: 9076 | Location: Newmarket, UK/ Antibes, S.France | Registered: 07-14-02Reply With QuoteEdit or Delete MessageReport This Post
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