I just looked up "hangups" and discovered that it isn't a word. So we have to go with "hang-ups," which means "sources of mental or emotional difficulty" or "problems."
Yes, looking at the question, religious folks have such problems; otherwise, they wouldn't be forcing their views down others' throats, threatening to kill others, or, as frankvan wrote, believing in God, etc. I was thinking that such behaviors are the hang-ups, but such behaviors are only the manifestation of such problems. To make the question easier, I am fishing for the annoying behaviors, but if anyone suspects which hang-ups are behind the annoying behaviors, revealing these hang-ups would be even more interesting. Oh, all right, what's bugging religious folks to act the ways that they do?
It's still not very clear what you're asking, Tsaeb. 'What's bugging religious folks to act the ways that they do?' That's kind of a sweeping question. Religious people would say divine inspiration, I guess, but object to the word 'bugging', while atheists might say accidents of evolutionary psychology, human history or an individual's upbringing.
I'd have defined a 'hangup' as something a person can't be rational or reasonable about, or maybe something they've gotten out of perspective, but anyway something that has a significant negative impact on their life. The basic religious impulse tends to be a matter of faith rather than reason, so Frank's first answer maybe answers your question - but I guess many would object to the negative implications of the word 'hangup'.
What's bugging religious folk to act the way they do, Tsaeb? Well, I'm sure it varies from one individual to another just as much as their particular set of beliefs does. I suspect that when one has sufficient faith in a supreme being and what S/He, It wants, in an attempt to please that being, almost any behaviour seems justified.
Unfortunately, imposing the 'justified behaviour' on others who do not share an identical or similar faith in the same deity, can indeed bug them. I happen to be one who doesn't always appreciate the uninvited attentions people of faith choose to inflict on me. Much as I love you, your assumption that I must be flattered by being included in your coterie of fellow theists, solely on the basis of my reticence,is distateful. Fred has pointed out in several posts that this is a peculiarly American trait, the un-asked-for references to prayer, religious affiliations, etc. Tactful members of other civilized cultures refrain from announcing their private views on - and/or enquiring into matters such as the religious beliefs of their political candidates, etc. Stll, it's the poison pill for American political hopefuls.
I think we look like a bunch of country bumpkins to much of the world in the ease with which we tell casual acquaintences to: "pray with us", "we all believe in God", "dear Homer has gone to a better place", etc. etc. There is no good reason that I can think of why people can't simultaneously believe in whatever gods they prefer AND still acknowledge that some few others may not! In my experience, Christians are the worst offenders. Jews, Muslims, or Buddhists do not ever seem to bug me.
Jews don't seem to proselytize at all, bless their hearts! I think their view is that Jehovah chose them from very early on to be his chosen people, so why should they spread it around? Or maybe they find other religious people to be tricky and unpredictable, sort of like zoo monkeys, might bite, might not, so they just think it wise to keep a low profile.
Posts: 6257 | Location: British Columbia, Canada | Registered: 06-11-02
It would be discriminatory for Judaism to proselytize and try to convert those not of the religion. That would imply that everybody needs to be Jewish in order to make a relationship with God, participate in the Torah's vision of repairing the world, and "get to heaven." Yet this is not so.
The idea of demanding everyone to convert is probably familiar to you as a Christian ideal. For example, just this week, a Baptist group in Florida is spending over $1 million to distribute a video entitled "Jesus" to every household in Palm Beach County. It's no coincidence that 60 percent of these homes are Jewish.
Be that as it may, the Jewish idea is that the Torah of Moses is a truth for all humanity, whether Jewish or not. The Torah (as explained in the Talmud - Sanhedrin 58b) presents seven mitzvot for non-Jews to observe. These seven laws are the pillars of human civilization, and are named the "Seven Laws of Noah," since all humans are descended from Noah. They are:
1) Do not murder. 2) Do not steal. 3) Do not worship false gods. 4) Do not be sexually immoral. 5) Do not eat the limb of an animal before it is killed. 6) Do not curse God. 7) Set up courts and bring offenders to justice.
Maimonides explains that any human being who faithfully observes these laws earns a proper place in heaven. So you see, the Torah is for all humanity, no conversion necessary.
As well, when King Solomon built the Holy Temple in Jerusalem, he specifically asked God to heed the prayer of non-Jews who come to the Temple (1-Kings 8:41-43). The Temple was the universal center of spirituality, which the prophet Isaiah referred to as a "house for all nations." The service in the Holy Temple during the week of Sukkot featured a total of 70 bull offerings, corresponding to each of the 70 nations of the world. In fact, the Talmud says that if the Romans would have realized how much they were benefiting from the Temple, they never would have destroyed it!
Today, there are many active groups of non-Jews called "B'nai Noach" who faithfully observe the Seven Laws of Noah. You can see their web site at: http://chavurathbneinoach.home.att.net .
There is also an excellent book on the topic, called "The Path of the Righteous Gentile" by Chaim Clorfene and Yakov Rogalsky. It can be read for free on the internet at http://chabad.org/gopher/outlook/7laws/index.html .
newnickname: You identified some causes of hang-ups: "accidents of evolutionary psychology, human history or an individual's upbringing." I was thinking of the last two as causing one or many in a group to be frustrated and to go against the grain, respectively, but what are "accidents of evolutionary psychology"?
Also, you defined a "hang-up" as "something a person can't be rational or reasonable about, or maybe something they've gotten out of perspective." So a person or many in a group can have a hang-up causing them to be hung up, it seems.
frankvan: You had identified belief in God as a hang-up of religious persons, and you added that you can get hung up about such a hang-up, based on what you identified as behavior justified to such believers but not to you, who believe the hang-up of the believers--faith in God--to be irrational. This can really be a bother, and we know how this can alienate believers and unbelievers. This is a tough situation when folks are at two extremes: God exists and no He doesn't.
Sherasi: I know that some Jews follow a particular school of thought and that any deviation from their favored rabbi is not allowed. They seem to me to be acting as members of a cult, much like evangelical Christians are so stubborn in their views gotten from their pastors. Yet, if the views of Jews were already as well known as those of evangelical Christians, then Jews would be in others' faces, too. It's the old success begetting success thing: once they convert one, they will seek to convert another. Yet, Jews and Muslims convert others when others seek to be converted, although there is coercion on the part of too many Muslims for conversion, especially when one is in a Muslim country or married to a Muslim. When countries and individuals get confused, flustered, defiant, coerced, etc., they can be said to have hang-ups or to be hung up.
No I didn't. I suggested an answer to your question "What's bugging religious folks to act the ways that they do?" I'm not sure why you'd want to call religious behaviour a 'hang-up'.
Evolution involves accidents. Chance mutations, that have a positive, negative or neutral impact on an organism's ability to reproduce. The mutations that have a positive impact tend to spread throughout a population, gradually changing it. Evolutionary psychology is a new-ish and very hypothetical branch of the field. However, it is possible to guess that accidents of our evolutionary history, like our being hierarchical social animals, for example, could make us more open to following Supreme Beings. Hyperintelligent dogs might become religious, but I doubt hyperintelligent cats would.
"Yet, if the views of Jews were already as well known as those of evangelical Christians, then Jews would be in others' faces, too."
This is pure supposition, based on little or no knowledge of the Jewish practices. In another thread on AP, it was clearly shown that Jews, if anything, try to discourage converts. The theory is that if one can be easily talked out of their new beliefs, then obviously those beliefs are not sincere or deep-rooted.
Posts: 17019 | Location: Lincoln Place, Granite City, IL, USA | Registered: 06-03-02
Tsaeb says, "... if the views of Jews were already as well known as those of evangelical Christians, then Jews would be in others' faces, too."
???
I know more about Jewish views than I know about evangelical Christian views. Yet no Jew has ever tried to convince me of anything except political stuff.
Posts: 6257 | Location: British Columbia, Canada | Registered: 06-11-02
Originally posted by newnickname: I'm not sure why you'd want to call religious behaviour a 'hang-up'.
newnickname: I hope that I didn't do that. Having given the questions some more thought, I think that "hang-ups" are "beliefs which hinder." Hang-ups, or beliefs which hinder, manifest in behaviors some of which are religious while others seem to be quite the opposite. It seems that participants here may be troubled by both religious and other behaviors of religious individuals and groups. I am wondering what are those hang-ups, an endeavor which leads us to get, I suspect, more controversial than informed of those beliefs which hinder.
DorienGrayed and babthrower: I live in a Jewish neighborhood. I am neither speculating nor going by others' speculations, but I am going by the results of conversations with such a variety of individual Jewish persons that I have to laugh at the thought that I either do not know what they reveal to me or that they keep their religious beliefs to themselves. I think that I have a talent for knowing how to get individuals to open up to me. No, I do not want to tell you what they say to me. Yet, yes, I do have some surprising experiences with them. Don't pass out, but I even dated a few Jewish men. So I do get the lowdown which is not ordinarily published. One thing which surprises me even more is when a Muslim buys my prophecy book despite my saying that Mohamed is supposed to be the last prophet so why in the world do you want to read my book? I've been told by those of various religions that I come across as charismatic, and so they want to know what is making me that way. Maybe I simply do not usually have hang-ups.
I've been told by those of various religions that I come across as charismatic, and so they want to know what is making me that way. Maybe I simply do not usually have hang-ups.
Aw, don't be so modest. I picture you as a sexy little Major Barbara. I'm on the verge of being converted.
Frank, you'd look adorable in the navy blue uniform, playing the bassoon! But it would be cruel to give tsaeb false hopes. You know very well you can't play the bassoon well and giggle at the same time!
Posts: 6257 | Location: British Columbia, Canada | Registered: 06-11-02
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