Hi, Prothero! This one's for you.
I read your comments, and always with interest (very informed & informative) and have just noticed on a second reading that, amongst other things which you recommend to Alisonwonder over in the classical music section, are the "odd" numbered Beethoven Symphonies.
Now we know you are a Beethoven disciple (no problem with that) but the "even" numbered symphonies contain great music, too... and if you are going to introduce a newcomer to this magical world, isn't the Pastoral Symphony as good a place to start as anywhere? I think that the link between the 4th & 5th movements is as profound as anything; well-performed it can raise the hairs on the back of my neck, or bring tears to my eyes (like when the barman says I have had enough and refuses to give me any more).
I know received wisdom is that, with the exception of his first, Beethoven's "odds" are greater than his "evens"... I don't always agree. And it certainly isn't black & white...(just being provocative but I would welcome your comments).
Cheers!
Ritz.

Always preferred the Sixth and Eighth to the Seventh (to quote Sir Thomas Beecham: "What can you do with it? It's like a lot of yaks jumping about.")

Hi, Decal!

Sir Thomas (arrogant, but funny) was always good for a quote. To a trombonist, blowing for all he was worth, he commented; "Are you producing as much sound as possible from that quaint and antiquated plumbing system which you are applying to your face?"

-Have to say, though, that I love all nine of them. Cheers!

Can't remember where this one originates, but speaking of a trombone "An ill wind that no one blows any good".

Hi, Andy! -Yes' I know that quote; but I believe that it was made about the oboe!...good one though...

also the string quartets, especially the latter ones.

Ritzmar ~ I may not be the fastest in responding, but I somehow get there in the end; the only excuse possible is that this post was unknown to me until recently.
It is difficult for me to imagine someone not wanting the complete symphonies, but my answer was based on the premise that such a person might exist. Although Beehtoven claimed he learned nothing at all from Haydn, it is my belief that he ignored the influence the man's music had on his own. When I listen to Beethoven's even numbered symphonies, I hear what could easily pass as the work of Haydn. It's not a negative as I enjoy the work of both, and I will even give you that the first and third could be placed in with the even numbers.
What came along in the fifth was something unique to Beethoven. A bold, almost driven expression. This was, in my opinion, the first symphony to express the forces working within the man.
The seventh might have been a continuation of the more typical effort, except that the second movement lifts it from the traditional. I've heard it called a funeral durge, but it seems to be something much more. It seems to express the hardships of life, or an expression of sorrows we experience, while at the same time there is the gentle sound of hope and victory over adversity. Apparently the first audience to hear this work demanded an encore of the second movement and I like to believe anyone who hears it would do the same. Of all the music I play (when others are aware of it) this is the one passage that draws the most attention, one lady even suggesting it was both sensual and sexual in nature.
That leaves the ninth. Considering what came before, both from Beethoven and others, this is the symphony that reaches a height unknown to composers. I certainly know of no other work that so universally inspires. Even those who have never heard it before seem to understand the effect. If the ninth had been the first, and he never again composed another piece, it would have been enough to insure his fame through the centuries. It is the work that I don't believe Haydn could have achieved.

Then comes the tenth. Listening to this, his final effort, he seems to be trying to blend the conventional with the grand. To give the traditional form the majesty of the ninth. Were the final one complete I might not be able to lump the even symphonies together.

Yet in the end it was merely an opinion, which is this: Every Beethoven symphony is exceptional, but if you only sample some of them, be bold and play the odds.

quote:

Then comes the tenth.

His tenth? I sure feel stupid; I thought he wrote nine.

quote:

Originally posted by juanruiz:

quote:

Then comes the tenth.

His tenth? I sure feel stupid; I thought he wrote nine.

He wrote nine himself The 'tenth' is a composite work assembled from odd fragments which have been understood to be the basis of a tenth. Not, perhaps, as authentic as Mozart's Requiem

Thanks for the prompt resonse, Prothero!

Here is something which is worth a look...

PS Regarding Haydn: I place him in the very front rank of all composers, and his piano sonatas, in the main, as being superior to those of Mozart...

I guess a clarification should have been offered about the (possible) 10th symphony. The compilation I first heard convinced me it was meant to be a final symphony, but scattered bits and pieces do not give proof to the idea.

As to Haydn, I am in absolute agreement. He seems under appreciated today and that is the mistake of those who seek great music. His is the music I use to calm the room; a tranquility from wall to wall nearly equal to the already mentioned second movement of Beethoven's 7th (which could be used, but only in repeat mode.)

Maybe we can agree that Mozart is often more fun than either H or B?

quote:

Not, perhaps, as authentic as Mozart's Requiem

While popular wisdom ascribes everything to the eighth bar of the Lachrymosa as Mozart's, others maintain that he had orchestrated nearly all the work, which Süssmeyer merely had to fill in. I've always had my suspicion of the Sanctus, though; pretty uninspired compared to the rest of the work.

Some people jokingly refer to the violin concerto as the Tenth Symphony because, they say, there's as lot more orchestra than violin !

Mozart's Requiem was given an outing at this year's Proms. The Times' reviewer was sniffy about the result because he felt that the British musicologist who had given us this attempt at completion had produced a mechanical, formulaic and flat work. If it was formulaic then Mozart's critics (not I ) would say it was pretty authentic then