My heat bill is scary. I mean my house is 64 degrees and my winter heat bills are $650 to the high of $750 a month. It really is that bad!
I adore my water heated radiators, but my gas furnace is a 1928 coal convert. I'm not sure if I can afford a new water heat system. Everyone I call sends me a salesman for huge profit, I keep saying no.
Does anyone know how much I should pay to replace my 1928 coal convert gas water radiator heat or should I convert it back to coal? Gas is a whole lot more convenient, but the cost of heating my house is outrageous. Coal isn't that expensive and has a long burn time.
I'm willing to shovel coal! Who do I call to convert my furnace back to coal? You really do have to go to the train tracks with a truck to be weighed and get the coal yourself. I can do that.
My dad heats his basement with a coal, where all his toys are. He heats the rest of his house with wood. His house is huge, but his heat bills are cheap, which is why his meters have been replaced five times now.
I refuse to pay today's gas prices, if I have another option, coal. Heating my house cost more than my house payment and escrow account. Personally, I think buying coal and go in the basement and shovel some in is worth it.
What do you think? **************************************************************** 11-13-06, 03:22 AM Sherasi Sagus and I actually moved from one really nice rental home because of the cost of heatin git. We were using only one room in the house during the day (a large livingroom) and heating it with a Kerosun heater. We kept the bathroom heated to 64 degrees so we wouldn't freeze to the floor or toilet. We heated the bedrooms at night. It was electric heat by baseboards. Using that much heat, we were still paying $400 a month. We had to move, we hated to but we did.
I think if you can get a good cross-referenced estimate from several companies about how much it would cost to convert back to coal, I'd do it. At $700 + a month heating, you are losing a LOT of money.
11-13-06, 06:52 AM Walks On Water If you are heating your house with a converted coal unit, I will guarantee it will more then pay for itself replacing it with a more efficient gas unit. Coal units were built to have a high chimney draft. This means more heat is going up your chimney then what is used to heat the water and your pulling in cold outside air to make up for what the heater uses for combustion.
It will not take you down to nothing but changing over to budget billing, the cost of the new unit and the operating cost of the new unit will be less then you are paying for heat now over a period of, let’s say, 10 years. If you own your home, it will improve the resale value when you need to sell. My bet is more then the cost of the unit. Some gas companies will even include the cost of the new unit in your bill.
New units can even heat your water for sinks and baths.
Coal heating is not cheap either. It also can be hazardous as there are no safety controls to turn off the heat should there be a problem.
There is nothing like waking up some cold morning and finding out that someone forgot to fire up the boiler.
Natural gas is the best way to go and if you live in a state like Ohio that allows you to “Shop” for the best gas price you will save even more.
Your best bet is to get quotes and recommendations from several better companies. Be sure they are quoting apples for apples. This means they are quoting for the same type of product. One my quote you for a normal unit and the other quotes for a high efficient unit. High efficient units cost more but save more in operating cost.
11-13-06, 07:57 AM MrsS Have you contacted the company that supplies your gas? Many, maybe most, utility companies offer free "energy audits" to pinpoint all the ways in which your home can be made more effecient and often there are grants, low or zero interest loans and rebates to offset the cost of upgrades or replacements (This can include new insulation, replacing older windows with double paned jobs that really do save a fortune)... and depending on your income, you may qualify for a reduction in your rate or at least a rescheduling of your bill to allow you to pay the same amount each month instead of having to accomodate this awful spike in the winter months. One thing that saves a lot around my place is my mattress pad...It's electric and allows me to be comfy cozy even when the house is cold. Another really simple penny saver is a timed thermostat, one that you set to turn the heat way down shortly after bedtime and when you go to work and turn it back up shortly before you wake up or get home.
Is putting in a wood stove an option? As you already know, wood heat is awfully nice and I've always found that I have had fewer sinus and respiratory problems when I've had wood heat.. just keep a heavy kettle full of water on the stove and voila no more overdried air (also beneficial to your books and wood furniture)
11-18-06, 01:33 AM Wildflower63 I don't have the cash to replace my 1928 coal convert gas furnace. I refuse to go into debt. If my car dies and I have $500 in my pocket, then I will drive a $500 car. That's how strongly I feel about debt.
Walk on Water is completely correct about my gravity water heated house and furnace type. He is correct that the design is not for gas, but to exhaust coal and allows most of my heat to be exhausted from the house. This is why I want to convert it back to coal.
It is safe to heat your house with coal. People older than me know the truth of it. In the day, everyone heated their house with coal. My parents still insist on heating their house with wood, but definitely can afford not to. My dad buys coal to heat his basement to do his projects during winter months. He has one of those coal burners from a caboose, which trains don't use anymore, but it heats his basement to comfort.
At this point, I have no concern for convenience, just saving a lot of money. I'm sick of paying $650 to $750 a month for heat in Cincinnati! It really isn't the North Pole here. No one in my home would know the difference. My house was only heated to 64 degrees. As you can see, this is no joke to me. We are about to turn blue, once again. I can do something about this, but what? Debt or coal? Debt isn't an option to me. Coal is.
I can convert my furnace back to what it was designed for, coal. I want to know how to do it! It is cheap and I know it. Been there too many times loading a truck with my dad to tell me this isn't the right thing to do for me, now. I don't have the cash for a new furnace, but can buy coal cheap.
I just want to know how to convert my furnace back to coal. Are there any elderly members here that remember heating their house with coal? It's not that bad. They lived through it, so why can't I?
11-18-06, 02:16 AM DorianGreyed You may not be able to heat your home with coal without extensive and expensive renovations to your existing furnace.
Coal was a dominant heating fuel up until the 1950's, even in the home heating market. Its use has declined steadily in all but the largest of industrial heating and power generation systems. While it is still one of the least costly and most plentiful energy sources, the cost of handling, coal burning equipment, ash disposal, and general maintenance issues have added to its fall from popularity. In addition, the recent EPA restrictions in "The Clean Air Act" will further detract from its acceptability in all but the largest applications. - Home Energy Library ---- When coal is burned, it produces sulfur dioxide and nitrogen oxide—the stuff that produces acid rain and smog—as well as particulate matter and mercury. Under the Clean Air Act, those pollutants must be removed from exhaust gases that come out of the smoke stack on the backend. And that requires expensive technologies that produce varying results. At the same time, the combustion of coal also produces substantial quantities of carbon dioxide, which is not currently regulated but the pressure to do so is increasing. - http://www.energycentral.com/centers/energybiz/ebi_detail.cfm?id=1 ---- When the coal burns, it gives off sulfur dioxide, nitrogen oxide and carbon dioxide, among other gases. The sulfur particulates are partly removed with scrubbers or filters. Scrubbers use a wet limestone slurry to absorb sulfur as it passes though. Filters are large cloth bags that catch particles as they go through the cloth. Scrubbers are more common, and can reduce sulfur emissions by up to 90 percent, when working properly. Still, smaller particulates are less likely to be absorbed by the limestone, and can pass out the smokestack into the air. - Union of Concerned Scientists -------- I am not sure how federal, state, or local restrictions on coal burning would affect you, but you need to find out before you invest any money.
11-19-06, 06:27 PM dodgecity maybe you should also look into insulating your home . it sound like its an older home and those always need to be insulation upgraded you would be surprized at how much just a little bit of insulation at the right places can help. a little here and a little there sure works wonders.
11-27-06, 05:20 PM Wildflower63 I appreciate your suggestions. I can't insulate this house. It's brick and plaster. Frame houses are different.
I have the original furnace of 1928. It was for coal use. The gas convert was a convenience, long ago when utilities were cheap. I would prefer to shovel coal than pay $650 to $750 a month during the winter. My heat bill would pay for a nice apartment and we should use this as a summer home if I can't fix this problem.
Apparently no one is familiar with old school coal heat, which is what my water heat radiators and furnace are designed for, coal, not gas! There is a huge difference in exhaust. Most of what I am paying for heats the outside, not my house.
I want to know how to make my origional coal burn furnace use coal again. I know there are easier options, like spend at least 5k and still pay the utility company a high price, just not as high as my present bill.
Although I really do appreciate options, I only want to know how to use this furnace for coal. Please tell me how to do this.
11-27-06, 07:38 PM dodgecity any house can be insulated thats why they invented spay foam Smile. as to getting your coal machine back its so out dated you may not be able to.with out someone there to see it its almost imposable to explain how to get it back to working condition. there's just to much that's not seen. it may have to be completely dismantled and then reassembled. sorry cant I be of more help.
11-27-06, 08:25 PM DorianGreyed "I can't insulate this house. It's brick and plaster."
You insulate the outside. There are a number of different sidings that provide insulation.
But you insist that you are going to listen to nothing except someone telling you how to return your furnace to a coal burner, despite my telling you that the laws may prohibit that, despite DodgeCity telling you that you may not be able to do it becaus your furnace is so old, and despite WoW, who deals with things like this for a living, telling you that it's a bad idea. You want your way, regardless of the facts and the common sense. Well, good luck. Good luck in converting an 80 year old furnace into one that may be illegal to use, will cost more to use, makes absolutely no sense, and may be impossible to do in any case. You want to make chicken soup without chicken. I've yet to see that recipe.
11-27-06, 09:27 PM Wildflower63 You are correct, if you own an old frame house. That can be insulated. When you own a brick home, the lathe boards are against the brick leaving no room for insulation.
I know how to insulate an older brick home. You have to put insulation board, next drywall. Your woodwork is not going to match up at all. This is so much dry wall that can't cut it, with inches of difference, making woodwork of windows so difficult.
Most homeowners pass on this idea. You have to put up drywall and finish it. This isn't an easy job, even if your woodwork could work without a problem. It doesn't work like that in brick homes.
You have to put up insulation board and drywall board on top of it. What to do with the woodwork of windows? When you figure out wood to make your windows look right, you have to do drywall finishing and paint every room in your house and that's a big job.
For a frame house, this is easy. You can have insulation blown in to make your house like a cooler. You can't do this with an older brick home.
I understand that you may think heating an old home is easy, but it is far from it. It might be that simple for a frame house, but not a brick one.
If you live in a newer home, you don't have large windows that do nothing but freeze you out in the winter. I do have many huge windows. The only option is insulated drapes.
Advice appreciated, but I know old homes, their beauty and the problems. I can't insulate a old brick house. I might be able to take the woodwork out another 1'1\2" and paint every room in the house, but undesirable. This is a large four bedroom house. Don't forget about window size and heat loss. Old homes have huge windows, so insulation isn't realistic issue to me.
The attic is as insulated as we could realistically get. That's all that can reasonably be done with a brick home.
That isn't what I asked. I already know about home insulation. I want to know how to burn coal in my 1928 coal convert water heated system. Coal is cheap.
11-27-06, 10:01 PM DorianGreyed Should I call my friends who put siding on their brick home and noticed a significant difference in both their comfort and their heating bills and tell them that they did it wrong?
11-28-06, 01:02 PM Julieta Martinez How about insulating an adobe home?
11-28-06, 02:56 PM DorianGreyed JM, if the adobe home has flat walls and 90° corners, I don't see why it couldn't have siding attached to it just like a regular brick home. If the walls are curved, I think a spray-on foam exists to insulate the outside, but then you'll have the problem of painting the surface of the foam. (I doubt that the foam can be exposed to direct sunlight without deteriorating.)
12-01-06, 12:57 PM DvdGStwrt I would shy away from coal for two points.
1. Environmental concerns.
2. Who shovels coal while I am away?
I might keep the gas convert and (if there is a chimney hole for stove pipe) add a wood/coal burning stove in the living area of the house.
Older stoves (cast iron with fire brick) come in plenty of designs - the ones with sealed fire chambers (closed door) usually can burn coal. Most often upright, top fed stoves do very well with coal, do not require that much space and have a high radiative index to them (more heat out of the stove and not up the flue).
You may see a big enough savings with that duel system to purchase a better gas/oil/electric furnace and the duct work too.
If you go to southern KY with a truck, you can buy coal cheaper than if you have it delivered - if you have a chain saw wood becomes very cheap.
Used to be a lot of used fire stoves on the market for 2-5 hundred dollars, I bet ebay sells them (Craig's List too?) They are cheaper to ship without the fire brick, many use standard fire brick which is sold in many places.
If your chimney is old enough, it will have flue holes ( mostly a central chimney). Most likely one in the kitchen, and one in living room/den. If this is a two story house perhaps one in the master bedroom. You can pretty much tell from the outside - the wider/thicker chimney's are usually designed for multiple fires, fire openings.
I might add - coal does burn hotter longer than wood - We used fans placed at door ways to push heated air through the house. Folk with central heating/ductwork could turn the fan to circulate to push the air around.
12-01-06, 09:25 PM Wildflower63 Environmental concerns definitely don't compete with my heat cost in an older home. I am far from harming wildlife, so stop with the guilt.
Who is home to shovel coal? No one! We don't need heat unless someone is home to use it. You don't understand. I can't spend money I don't have for a more efficient furnace.
I don't understand why no one knows where to buy coal at a good price. I do. Look at your local railroad. You load the coal yourself. The truck is weighed when you come in and when you leave. You pay the difference. I can do that. It is less than half price heating the house, if you already have a coal burner to heat you house.
I don't understand why everyone is trying to talk me out of a reasonable alternative, coal heat. That is what my furnace was designed for.
12-01-06, 10:04 PM gizmogram First, it's not the wildlife that is harmed by coal emissions, it's the air everyone has to breathe.
But what I really wanted to say is that I don't necessarily think everyone is trying to talk you out of using coal WF, it's obvious that's what you want to do...I think the primary focus has been trying to convince you that the cost of converting your furnace would be prohibitive, not to mention that trying to upgrade the old thing might not even be possible.
Near as I can tell, people have been trying to be as helpful as possible with giving alternative options - many viable alternatives have been given which would help, and COULD be done in the event your furnace cannot be converted back to coal.
Please get someone over to your house to see if it can be done, and at what cost- and be sure to let us know the outcome Smile
Good luck!
12-02-06, 01:20 AM DvdGStwrt
quote: Originally posted by Wildflower63: Environmental concerns definitely don't compete with my heat cost in an older home. I am far from harming wildlife, so stop with the guilt.
Who is home to shovel coal? No one! We don't need heat unless someone is home to use it. You don't understand. I can't spend money I don't have for a more efficient furnace.
I don't understand why no one knows where to buy coal at a good price. I do. Look at your local railroad. You load the coal yourself. The truck is weighed when you come in and when you leave. You pay the difference. I can do that. It is less than half price heating the house, if you already have a coal burner to heat you house.
I don't understand why everyone is trying to talk me out of a reasonable alternative, coal heat. That is what my furnace was designed for.
So when you leave for a couple + days in the dead of winter you are going to drain your pipes to prevent freezing and breaking? Modern heating is essential in modern homes with plumbing. Frozen pipes mean leaks - lots of leaks, in walls, in ceilings, under floors - big leeks, and worse little unnoticed leaks that lead to very, very expensive water damage.
I'm not talking you out of anything. I was giving you a (cheaper) alternative. And I did tell you where to get coal cheap.
Seriously an old gas/coal convert is not too safe to begin with - second, I seriously doubt you can convert it back to coal cheaply. Or efficiently.
So you need a cheaper path so you can save up money to bring your heating into the 21st century.
I can't manage your life and your finances sweetie, but what you want to do will cost you dearly in the end. A wood burning/coal burning stove is cheaper than doing a retrofit of any of those older furnaces. Used in tandem, heat the living area, not the sleeping area with wood/coal, use the gas furnace to maintain a livable temperature in the rest of the house (and to prevent pipes from freezing). Save some dollars in fuel to get your new furnace.
They don't deliver coal to homes anymore on a regular schedule like they once did, you will need to get into your truck and drive down to the coal place and get a load or two (in the summer) you will need to have a coal storage bin too. That is the cheapest way - Power companies buy by the hundreds of tones - big rig/lorry truck amounts not the amount used by a home in the average Kentucky winter. Sure, they may deliver a ton or so to your home, but I bet it won't be cheap.
In all honesty you need to really consider central heating - a 21st century method of heating the house - most of your gas is going up the flue not into heating your steam pipes. Those old furnaces are very, very inefficent they require a great deal of fuel to produce as much heat as modern, highly fuel efficient models do today. Switching or retrofitting that coal burning back to coal will require ripping out the gas supply, then the installation of bits and pieces which were removed when it was converted to alternative fuel. That is if you can find those parts, if the manufacturer is still in business.
And the coal shoot, the coal bin and perhaps new valves on the boiler?
So get yourself a contractor to come have a look see - have them look at your furnace and they will either laugh in your face at your notion or worse, behind your back as they screw you over financially in reconverting the furnace.
12-02-06, 09:44 AM aminator2002 Installing a new high efficiency boiler is definitely the way to go. Your coal or converted coal unit probably operates no better than 50% and new boilers can operate at 98% efficiency. From what I can tell from your post, you have the piping, you have a gas line to the location so all you need is the new unit and the connection. This is not as expensive as you might think. It would probably be less that $1500.
Paying someone to convert your old dinosaur back to coal is simply not a good idea as much as you wish people to tell you it is. You can pay someone to do it, shovel coal all winter, do yourself and the surrounding area some harm through the pollution and still only get a savings of a small amount. You will be glad you did it if you get a new high efficiency boiler.
Not going into debt just isn't a good reason to continue to pay more for heating your home than you should. You can probably find some old timer to take off the conversion and find the antique parts for you but the money you spend on that is wasted money. You've actually done something to ruin the resale value, that cost you money and made you into a coal shoveler for the winter.
So call some contractors and see if they'll help you. You certainly aren't going to find many that want to get involved in such an idea.
12-04-06, 01:28 AM Wildflower63 I realize that you guys think I lost my mind a long time ago. There is a method to my madness! lol!
My husband, the one waiting for me to die first so he takes all assets, owns the other half of the house. This place could be a beauty in the perfect neighborhood, but it's not. We bought it as a rehab 15 years ago. We couldn't afford not to. Five years later we separated.
I get no divorce intil my daughter turns 18 or save him the trouble and just die. He gave me a buy out price and it's fair to both of us.
I'm afraid to do anything but start projects and not finish them making the house look even more horrible or his price goes up and I wont be able to buy him out.
What it takes is removing added things to my coal burner furnace, not really adding. There never was a thermostat or anything using electric or gas line and internal fixture, but there is now. It used to work by shoveling coal in only.
The furnace definitely needs to be replaced. It's a little hard to screw things up that are already a big problem. For example the water damaged ceilings. That doesn't look nearly as bad as what I did. I ripped up ceiling tiles that need to go anyway putting drywall in and taped it up.
I have found a few ways to start projects, but not finish them to make this house truly scary. It isn't like this wouldn't have to be done to rehab anyway, but keeps the buy out price fair. He is expecting me to spend a lot of money and do all the work because he knows me too well. I wont let this house go for nothing.
I'm not saying this for anyone to adress my family issues, so please don't! I know what I'm doing. In two years I'm going to have to buy his half out. I want the house. I can afford it with a fair price to him and me.
My elderly parents live only seven houses away. Ever heard about Pride being one of the Seven Deadly Sins? My parents really do take pride to the level of sinnful. They need me, but too proud to admit it.
I really do just have to visit and find out the fact they haven't had hot water for days because my dad has Altzheimer's. I have had my dad come over in a panic claiming my mom fell asleep at the kitchen table. He is scared because she wont wake up. She is an insulin dependent diabetic in a suguar low coma! He doesn't get it.
My kids don't have any post high school education at all. They need it. We can't assume our kids, who have to reinvent the wheel wont be stupid enough to move out on their lousy restaurant jobs and get an apartment they can't afford, later to come home and understand exactly why you got furious with their attitudes to begin with. Finally, they are ready and much more respectful.
I need a choice. I already know my husband has too many excuses not to help our kids, once adult. I know my brother wont do anything for my parents and 93 year old grandma. I need the house, for now.
I love rehab projects, but not for my husband to do nothing but laugh his way to the bank. I have two years before our daughter turns 18.
I hope you guys understand what I'm going through and it's so hard. I really do want this furnace converted back to coal. Let my husband get a look at that! He will be horrified to allow a realitor in here. Well, I do have a few other projects just ugly enough, but doing it right. He won't see it that way.
I want my house. I don't want to be robbed for my own labor and money. His price of today I didn't even question. It is fair to both of us. I want it to stay that way. He hates rehab and doesn't get it that things have to get ugly before they become pretty and I'm buying.
I hope that explains my insanity and dead set on coal heat. I'm just sorry you had to hear it.
12-04-06, 07:10 AM Walks On Water Is coal a big savings to heat your house? I know from were you come. My Mom has Altzheimers.
But for your own safety and piece of mind, do not try to convert this unit back to coal. I talked with several of my colleages and none of them would recommend this on an old unit.
I have been in the HVAC business for over 40 years and have seen furnaces and boilers that have been converted from coal to gas. I would not even think about changing them back.
First gas is a “Controlled Heat”. When to flames comes on, you know just how much heat you have and where. With coal, you could get hot spots or over heating that can be dangerous.
Second and most important, with gas, you have safety controls that protect your unit from over heating and causing damage. Water boilers or heaters, unlike air furnaces, have water which build in pressure as the water heats up. This pressure, with out safeties and controls, can build up enough to cause major damage to the unit and even you house.
Now, as for saving money. For the home owner, gas heat is cheaper then coal with the right unit. Coal and wood these days is not cheap unless you are buying a tremendous amount.
For everybody.
If you have hot water or steam heat, have your unit check at the beginning of each heating season by a certified heating contractor. Have the company instruct you on how to do a weekly or at least a monthly check for your own comfort and safety.
12-04-06, 07:53 AM aminator2002 I certainly hope that inspite of your self proclaimed insanity that you listen to Walkonwater.
12-04-06, 01:33 PM clarebear Try contacting some historical houses in your area. Many of them still use coal burning stoves. They should be able to refer you to someone who repairs, maintains and installs them. Ask for their maintenance contact number.
12-06-06, 09:24 AM doñadiana When I was about 8 years old, my dad installed a coal furnace in an old house such as the one you are living in except it probably wasn't a brick house. I was sick with sinus problems until we moved to a different house. Something to think about if you are prone to allergies.
We used to close off all the rooms except the kitchen and living room in the winter. These two rooms were heated with space heaters.
We put heavy plastic over all the windows. This was in Iowa and we had really cold winters.
You could use electric blankets in the bedrooms or lots of blankets...wool preferably.
I assume you have high ceilings. If your ceiling structure will allow it, install ceiling fans to blow the hot air that collects at the ceiling down to the floor. In the summer the air flow can be reversed to cool the room.
These are just ideas that I remember from when I was growing up. I don't know how practical they are now, but at the time they were cheap solutions that made the long, cold winters more endurable without adding to the assessed value of the house.
DD
12-06-06, 09:23 PM DvdGStwrt Fine, call a contractor and tell them what you want - ignore the advice given, be stubborn and get yourself maimed, killed, whatever. Maybe you will just burn down the house and it won't be any body's problem any more.
Bet that will fix your husband real good, no?
Eek
12-07-06, 10:17 AM Georgia85 Have you ever lived in a house that was "heated" by coal and do you know what to expect? The only heat upstairs is dependent upon the hot air rising which usually does not work well. When the weather is cold and you try to heat water you will often times just get steam and no hot water (lots of cold showers). Plus you get a lot of ashes from the coal which will get tracked throughout your house. In addition, there is not a lot of heat from the coal and you will have to supplement it with wood and paper. And what about summers? You will need to burn coal to get your hot water so how do you intend to handle that additional heat in your house? And a word about the dangers of coal burning...coal gives off soot which builds up in the chimney which will cause the combustion draft to stop. Those gases (carbon dioxide and carbon monoxide) will fill your house. Do you plan on at least having a detector?
There is a reason why homes are not heated with coal now. It's dirty, dangerous, and not effecient. However, if you want to do that there are new models of furnaces that are combination wood/oil or wood/gas furnaces that can be used to heat coal. They can save you up to 80% of your fuel bill but cost aroun $7000. I did find a coal furnace for $1099.50 if you are interested in checking that out. Norseman Solid Fuel Warm Air Add-On Furnace.
12-07-06, 11:29 AM FredPuli Coal is definitely to be avoided. We had an anthracite boiler: anthracite is a very hard coal, which is in small grains,and produces a lot of heat for its weight. It requires a special boiler. That was state of the art in 1953 Smile Guess what? We changed it as soon as oil-fired heating came in, because it produced clinker that someone had to remove, the fumes were noxious when that was being done,it was dusty and you needed an automatic hopper unless you fancied going out (or sending staff out Roll Eyes ) to the coal bunkers in the yard every day or two, all year, unless it was high Summer and you could get away with immersion heaters for water and the occasional electric fire to take any evening chill off a room.
Now, that was as good coal heating as it ever was possible to get Smile
There has been an extraordinary fashion for Aga ranges in Britain. These combine heating with a cooking range and ovens.They are usually coal-fired, though they can use wood. Town people buy them when they buy a place in the country because they think it is just what country people have and its, traditional, trendy or cool to have one. (Nobody asks genuine country people why they got rid of their own Agas many years ago Big Grin ) Even traditionalist country people have oil-fired or Calor gas (butane)or even electric heating rather than coal or wood stoves Smile We do have open fires, but that's another matter.
12-14-06, 07:44 PM Wildflower63
quote: Originally posted by clarebear: Try contacting some historical houses in your area. Many of them still use coal burning stoves....
Thank you! At least someone is pointing me the right direction. I appreciate that.
quote: Originally posted by doñadiana:....We used to close off all the rooms except the kitchen and living room in the winter. These two rooms were heated with space heaters.
We put heavy plastic over all the windows. This was in Iowa and we had really cold winters.
You could use electric blankets in the bedrooms or lots of blankets...wool preferably.
I assume you have high ceilings. If your ceiling structure will allow it, install ceiling fans to blow the hot air that collects at the ceiling down to the floor. In the summer the air flow can be reversed to cool the room.
Thank you for the advice, but I have already done exactly as you said. I bought electric mattress pads for my daughter's bed and mine. I'm not heating the upstairs at all, with exception to a space heater to keep the plumbing from freezing. Plastic does help with windows, but when you have so many huge windows and a high ceiling, it only does so much.
So far, I have made it to December without turning on my furnace. I have gas logs that do not require vent heating my first floor. It's still expensive. I sleep on my fold out couch bed. My daughter refuses to use the dining room to sleep. Keep in mind that my daughter thinks money grows on trees at 16.
quote: Originally posted by DvdGStwrt: Fine, call a contractor and tell them what you want - ignore the advice given, be stubborn and get yourself maimed, killed, whatever. Maybe you will just burn down the house and it won't be any body's problem any more.:
I knew someone would say that, 'stubborn'. I'm not going to kill anyone with coal heat. This house was heated with coal for years, like every other house in my neighborhood. Believe it or not, no one died and every single house is still standing. I am not being unreasonable.
Everyone may think my family is back there in time. They are. My father is a senile telephone man that will die with assets well over expectation because of choice in lifestyle. Is it right to pay for expensive heat knowing my two kids need an education? It isn't.
quote: Originally posted by Georgia85: Have you ever lived in a house that was "heated" by coal and do you know what to expect?.....
To answer your question, I do know what to expect. As I said before, my brother and I were taught very young how to heat a house with wood and coal.
I'm the one that broke the grate of my father's wood stove because I didn't know the difference in how hardwood vs. soft wood burned. My dad was furious! Because I was such an idiot not to notice the difference in grain of wood that broke the grate, my dad was ready to hit me in the head with two logs, hard wood and soft wood trees that he cut down.
I know how to burn coal also. Coal is a slow burner. You really can go to sleep at night and not have to start over again. Never put too much coal to burn. It doesn't take that much and coal is a long burn. I know that because my father taught me.
My family may be different than yours. My dad can't tell me how to make my furnace burn coal anymore. He has Alzheimer's. No matter how stupid you guys think burning coal is, my furnace was designed for coal, not gas.
So far, I am not seeing a reasonable alternative to coal heat, which my furnace was designed for. I am open to thought of alternatives, if affordable. I just ask for help. I do appreciate input from members. If there is a better way, tell me. Right now, I don't see anything better than coal to heat my house.
12-14-06, 11:27 PM Dwight
quote: Fine, call a contractor and tell them what you want -
Doesn't that statement answer all your questions? Why must this thread go on and on and on...
12-15-06, 09:05 AM aminator2002
quote: If there is a better way, tell me. Right now, I don't see anything better than coal to heat my house.
Yes, take out a home equity loan and buy a gas fired high efficiency boiler.
It's obvious yet you want to go hunt down antique parts to convert your furnace - you'll need an antique loader that fits your furnace. These parts will be obsolete for about 50 years. You'll pay for parts and installation and probably a large premium for someone to find the proper parts for you. I am guessing that the parts you need will represent half of what it would cost to do the job right.
But Dwight is right - stop this thread and just call local contractors. Come back and tell us we were wrong after you have some information to back it up and spare us these long diatribes about your extensive experience with heating systems.
12-15-06, 08:06 PM Wildflower63 I get the message. This thread doesn't have to go on and on. I can't take out a home equity loan because my husband owns half of this house. I can't do anything to this rehab but scare him with my projects or pay ten times over for my own work and financial investment.
If no one knows how to heat a house with coal, there is no need to post. There is also no need to be annoyed with me for asking how to do this.
Apparently everyone thinks I lost my mind. No one, especially people of my age or younger, grew up with a family that is so old school. It was expected of my brother and I to know how to heat a house with wood and coal.
If you don't like the thread, you don't have to post and be annoyed by my question. I can and will look elsewhere to convert my original furnace to use coal again.
My apology for annoying members. I will heat this house with coal with or without your advice. Only one member headed me in the right dirrection, thanks Claire. You don't have to like my idea, but you don't need to insult me for it either.
I always thought my dad was insane too, but he dies worth a fortune because of his conservative ways. I'm not crazy. In two years, my dad's gas meter has been replaced four times because of his wood and coal heat, but a huge house.
12-19-06, 12:57 PM DvdGStwrt
quote: Originally posted by Wildflower63: I get the message. This thread doesn't have to go on and on. I can't take out a home equity loan because my husband owns half of this house. I can't do anything to this rehab but scare him with my projects or pay ten times over for my own work and financial investment.
If no one knows how to heat a house with coal, there is no need to post. There is also no need to be annoyed with me for asking how to do this.
Apparently everyone thinks I lost my mind. No one, especially people of my age or younger, grew up with a family that is so old school. It was expected of my brother and I to know how to heat a house with wood and coal.
If you don't like the thread, you don't have to post and be annoyed by my question. I can and will look elsewhere to convert my original furnace to use coal again.
My apology for annoying members. I will heat this house with coal with or without your advice. Only one member headed me in the right dirrection, thanks Claire. You don't have to like my idea, but you don't need to insult me for it either.
I always thought my dad was insane too, but he dies worth a fortune because of his conservative ways. I'm not crazy. In two years, my dad's gas meter has been replaced four times because of his wood and coal heat, but a huge house.
Just because your Dad had a coal fired furnace doesn't mean that you can have one too. He most likely got his coal adapted back in the day and age that they still made parts for coal burning furnaces circa 1920. Today we are nearly 90 yeas removed from then with gas, electric and highly efficient central air systems.
I'm of your age, I chopped wood, carried wood, put it in the wood burning stove - later we switched to coal, that meant driving down to Southern KY where we shoved coal from the heap into the back of the truck (Talk about frugal, my father didn't want to spend the $5.00 for a truck to dump a load of coal into his truck!) then shovel it all out into "The Pit" where I got to spend all winter long taking buckets back and forth twix Pit and Stove to keep the shack we lived in (house? I think not) heated. Yes we had running water, You ran to the cistern, dropped a bucket, pulled up a bucket of water, poured that into another bucket and you ran that back to the house. We used a privy for the BM's and pee'd out over behind the outhouse (so as to not fill the hole in the ground with liquid).
I considered very carefully my answer before I answered the first time. I know that oil and gas are high priced, and I agree coal is cheap. However I also read where you own a coal burner from the beginning of last Century that is a poor conversion to gas from Coal. I know that Coal burning boiler systems are different from gas burning boiler systems, I know that in conversions they take out a lot of "unnecessary" parts and put in a lot more interesting "unnecessary parts".
You requested Cheaper heating, what came to mind was a centrally located wood burning/coal burning pot belly stove affair - Set your thermostat on the gas furnace to 40-45 F use that only to prevent freezing in the house use the coal stove to heat for comfort.
Trust me adding a pot belly stove will not increase the value of the house (They are ugly affairs usually) but it will definitely give you a safe way to burn coal that will not cost you an arm and a leg to buy and install. It will give you the chance to use two kinds of fuel - coal and wood - say your neighbors take out a tree, you can most likely get that wood for free since they most likely would have to pay somebody to haul it away where they would chop it and re-sell it and make double the profit.
It will keep the gas system you have in case you have an emergency where you are not there in the dead of winter to feed coal and prevent things from freezing (frozen pipes are real expensive to replace).
You get a contractor (licensed professional) to come out and he will most likely tell you that the building code will NOT allow a reconversion to coal of such an antique - In fact you most likely will discover that the Code will insist that if ANYTHING goes wrong with your converted gas fueled boiler system that you MUST buy a brand new furnace that is up to date with local, regional and state laws for safety purposes. It could also now read that you MUST replace the system if you try to sell the house. Building Codes are cracking down, and they are working on a national system that will most likely increase the demands nationally on what can and can not be in a house.
Of course you could do it illegally - again I remind that you could maim, kill yourself or your children - or you could end up burning down the house which would then cease to be a thorn in the side of your divorce contract with your husband.
PS:Another thing.
Each year the propane folk come out to light the furnace (although I can do it myself county law forbids my actually lighting my own pilot lights Roll Eyes )
I live in a single wide trailer circa 1959 the Furnace is a gas burning fan and floor duct work propane burning affair.
Technically it is outside of the new building codes and technically it should be replaced. If it needs so much as a screw and the plumber guy is called out he will not work on it (can not by law) and will direct our attention to newer propane furnaces.
Due to recent environmental concerns (Global Warming?) and due to the increase in fuel prices building codes are becoming a lot more strict on what one can and can not heat with. Two counties over they passed a new law that wood stoves and wood fireplaces can not be built into new homes and that only homes that already have those can use them.
01-07-07, 11:42 PM Wildflower63 My furnace is original to burn coal. It was adapted to burn gas. Remove this and shovel coal.
Sad to say, but my home furnace is designed for coal. Thank you all for trying to help me!
This message has been edited. Last edited by: DorianGreyed,
