Kittypal and other cat folk here, I have a question!

This past winter we had a couple of cats show up (probably dumped) and take up residence on our front porch (probably because we put cat food in dishes for them, but hey, were we supposed to let them starve?)

Long story short, the female was pregnant and had 4 kittens in March. We found homes for 2 of them- one left last week at 8 weeks old, the other left today at 9 weeks. Mommycat doesn't seem to miss them. The other 2 kittens are probably going to stay with us, but not outside. We've been bringing them inside to meet the dogs and other cats and then taking them back out to the "playpen" on the porch.

I think she's still nursing them once in a while but she certainly doesn't stay with them all day. I'm wondering- If we bring the little guys in, will mom get depressed? I can't see bringing one in and then the other but I don't want her to freak out. It tooks a month to get her to trust us.

NOte-Mommycat will be getting spayed in a couple weeks. If she knew what a litterbox was, I'd consider letting her inside but she has ignored the one on the porch, preferring to use the neighbor's non-grass covered yard. (All the cats in the neighborhood use it, including theirs so I don't feel bad about it. They shouldn't have torn all the grass out.)
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05-22-06, 01:21 AM
babthrower
You could try her in a sheltered part of the house (I mean where she won't feel she's not safe) using clean litter and a sprinkling of earth from the neighbor's non-grass covered yard. Then if she still doesn't 'catch on', draw her paws gently through the litter, in the burying motion. I did that with a stray once, and she promptly peed and covered it neatly!

That cat was a terribly skinny calico that my husband started feeding. Then, late in November when the weather was horrible, sleet, snow and high wind, my husband wanted to bring her in because she was heavily pregnant. So I said 'sure', but -- there were no kittens! Turned out the pot-belly was due to hub's good feeding!

It took us several weeks of daily grooming, my husband holding her and me combing and clipping, to get her coat clean and free of wadded hair. We named her Lina Wurtmueller.

She was with us for three years. She had been hit by a car, the vet told us, and had a broken pelvis which had been untreated and the bones knit, and she had pelvic nerve damage, so could not have kittens, also she had to periodically be taken for extraction of impacted feces. Once he noticed tumors, and they proved malignant. They were removed, but the next time she needed fecal extraction I had her put down. She had had three years of peace and comfort, and if we had kept her longer, may have had spreading cancer and a lot of pain. She was a tough cat, and did not show her pain.

She loved my husband totally. When she gazed at him, her eyes glowed. She was the only cat I ever saw obey a command. She grew so large and strong she bullied our two other cats. But if my husband caught her, he'd point to a particular chair, and she would reluctantly head toward it. She would pause, and look at him. But the determined finger still pointed, so she would jump onto the chair and behave herself for the rest of the day.

05-22-06, 08:50 AM
Rakuchild
Hi, bab. Sweet story about your rescued buddy.

We've got 3 dogs and 3 (neutered) males in the house and it's a juggling act to keep the ones that get along away from the ones that don't. The kittens have done well in their test visits and have figured out who their friends are.

I just want to be sure not to freak her out when she sees her kittens are all gone from the porch. She's got a bond with the male cat that stays there- they've got their own boxes and blankies so she's got a pal. (He's fixed so no more kitten making days for him.)

Not having time to littertrain a cat (the kittens had no problem picking up what the litterbox was for) and having the need for a few outdoor cats to keep the rodent population controlled, I'd rather keep her fed and secure on the porch. I just wonder if taking the remaining kittens too soon after the other two are gone will affect her in any way.

05-22-06, 12:16 PM
babthrower
Well, 6 weeks to 2 months is not too bad. When she goes in heat again (which could happen any day now) then it seems to affect the mother-kitten bond, the mother has to get ready for the next litter. If she goes in heat now, she could well be pregnant when she goes for neutering. They remove both uterus and ovaries in that case. Costs more.

So if you bring the kits in now and move up the spaying date, might be all right.

Would be good to have some other person (not of your household) live-trap her (you can probably borrow a live trap from the Humane Society and drop her off and pick her up from the vet, then release her near (in sight of ) your yard so she won't blame you guys for her kidnapping.

I think that although cats are passionately attached, still they seem to have short memories. I guess it's nature's way. In the wild they would lost all but one or two kittens to predators or starvation so they have to be tough enough to take it.

05-22-06, 05:20 PM
kittypal
Raki,

I have the same problem right now, about a year ago there was a tuxedo cat trying to break into the trash on garbage night so obviously I figured he was a hungry stray...I immediately set out a dish of food on the porch...the following night he showed up with a momma cat and two tiny kittens in tow....I have been putting food out every night ever since...They STILL will not come near me, they will move to the side walk....ANYWAY....About a week or so ago I hear pitiful little mews avbout 3 in the morning, I look out to see no food and momma cat with three more little tiny kittens...I am seriously considering trying to get them, but am afraid of breaking up the family...On the other hand if this keeps up I won't be able to afford the food for them...One of the kittens from last summer must not have survived, I only see the one who is now a full grown cat....It is so heart breaking...I do not want to call animal control (I did call the humane society last year and they said that they would put the cats to sleep and if the kittens were over 3 months they would also be put down) I can't bear they be put to sleep, but if we have a harsh winter they may suffer???? Frown Confused

05-22-06, 07:24 PM
babthrower
Here the Humane Society is anti-euthanasia. They live-trap, neuter and release. Kittens are 'gentled' by volunteers until they can be handled, then adopted out. Unadopted animals (or adults that for some reason can't be released back into their turf) are put on a farm whose owner is paid for food and vetting by the Society.

If you ask around, you may find an organziation that provides that level of care.

But if such care is not avialable at all, then surely euthanasia is better than the hunted, starved life that kittens have in the cities and on the streets. Sometimes they are caught and tortured by sadists; sometimes they are trapped and fed to snake-owners; sometimes people put out poison and the animals die a miserable death. Most often they die from being attacked by dogs. (Some dog-owners gleefully 'sic' their dogs on stray cats for sport.) Some are hit by cars and crawl away to get better or die alone and in pain. They seldom live beyond two or three years.

One study showed that about 50% of feral kittens die before three months of age, and 70% die before six months.

And if you let these kittens mature unneutered, they will be producing litters themselves within a few months.

You might want to ask your vet about options. Some vets have concern for feral animals, and may have access to some support information. If you decide to have these kittens neutered yourself, then release them, the vet may be able to give you a break on the cost of neutering.

05-22-06, 09:50 PM
Rakuchild
Kittypal- Here's a group we've worked with to live trap and neuter the male cat that lives on our porch.

http://catteam.org/

They have directions on how to build an inexpensive cat shelter. Also, if you write them, they may know of a similar group in your area. We were trying to catch the female but we caught the male and they didn't charge us for fixing him. They've spent up their budget for May and their June vets are too far away for us so we've pulled together the money for the female. We've found that providing food and shelter has kept the cats from wandering.

We had no choice today but to bring the little guys in. They figured out how to climb out of the "playpen" we fixed up for them. We let mom in to see where they were and once she saw them playing on the stairs, she was satisfied and went back out to the porch, where is she sitting now as is her habit. The male is with her- they're pals.

05-23-06, 06:06 PM
kittypal
THanks bab and Raku...I have tomorrow off and will look into this more...There is a woman in our area who runs a place called Kitty Haven, she takes in strays gets them fixed and fosters them until they can be adopted, but she is all full and can't take anymore...I am going to do something....I did build a shelter last fall but the only thing that seemed to like it was the stooopid possum, he also likes the cat food and ignores the cat's only sign I put up! Roll Eyes Smile

Raku, I am sooo happy your little kitty strays are feeling at home, how wonderful.

05-24-06, 05:01 PM
Rakuchild
Funny you should mention a possum! I was putting the porch back into its pre-kitten mode and found a young possum sleeping in one of the boxes the kittens had outgrown.

I called some wildlife line and they told me it was illegal for me to move the possum from my property! And they wouldn't come get it either! Very much hoping we don't have an interspecies WWF smackdown tonight!

05-24-06, 06:21 PM
kittypal
I think possum are pretty mellow unless they are cornered....I opened the door and told it to shoo, he ignored me completely at first them finally looked up with his mouth full and continued to chew, then went back to eating. Roll Eyes He IS kinds cute with his silvery fur, long glistening whiskers, and little black eyes.

05-25-06, 07:27 PM
Rakuchild
Ah, will you be changing your name to Possumpal? Big Grin

05-26-06, 12:47 AM
babthrower
Ooh, we are so pathetic! I saw a flash of something in the crawl space the other evening, and my husband set a trap. In the morning there was this sweet little white-and-brown mouse in it, dead of course. I said to my husband, "Isn't it a pity? He 's so cute." And he said, "I always feel like such a jerk when I trap one."

But we both know that mice multiply amazingly fast. If we don't control their numbers, they themselves suffer from overpopulation, then starvation and disease.

Of course we wish everything could live, but it's not possible.

I wish it were. I would like to be an animal rescuer on a massive scale!

05-26-06, 12:21 PM
Rakuchild
We don't see many live mice around here. If they make it past the dogs in the backyard, there is still an army of cats in the house and on the front porch to contend with.

One reason I'm good with having stray cats live on the porch is to combat the rodent problem in the city. We have shared dumpsters in the alley and that attracts rats, possums, the occaisional racoon. My dogs have caught a possum and a few rats that have been foolish enough to try to cross the yard in the past few years. But what they're living for is to catch a squirrel. I think they would actually co-ordinate efforts with the porch cats if it meant taking out a pesky squirrel. Big Grin

05-26-06, 01:47 PM
babthrower
We had a cat that the squirrels tortured on a daily basis. They would shriek obscenities at him, and follow him, he on the ground, they in the trees. We have so many trees they usually managed to be pretty close to him, and it unnerved him! He would glare at them in frustrated rage.

Then one day he caught two! After years of failure! He brought them to the deck, too, so we could see that he really, really relished eating them.

Then my husband noticed that after Sq#2 was dispatched, the cat went under our truck, which I had parked under the trees because of the heat. Sure enough. This gave Tino cover from which to dash out as they dashed across a patch of earth going from a Ponderosa Pine to a Douglas Fir.

So my husband built the squirrels an overpass from the pine to the fir, by attaching a pole to an extended branch on each tree.

No more dead squirrels.

But the story reminds me what a sweet guy my husband is. I think I'll go outdoors, now, and find him and kiss him. Smile
05-26-06, 09:07 PM
Tree
Awwww how sweet bab!

05-27-06, 06:40 PM
kittypal
Awwww!!!!

I think people who love ALL animals are great people, it definitely means they are compassionate and kind.

I LOVE squirrels...they do love to tease the animals though....When we had our old cat Smitty who was an indoor/outdoor cat the squirrels KNEW he was old and no longer interested in the chase, so they would actually get on the porch with him and would get closer and close until they would step on his tail or walk under him when he got up to go to another squirrel-free spot.

I did stop feeding the squirrels though, one chewed through the screen and tried to help himself to the peanut jar n the kitchen counter.

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